Comments on: George Orwell: Nineteen Eighty-Four

By: Nineteen eighty-four – George Orwell « Balwyn Best Books

Nineteen eighty-four – George Orwell « Balwyn Best Books — Sun, 14 Aug 2011 11:43:30 +0000

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By: Trevor

Trevor — Wed, 25 May 2011 03:11:27 +0000

Josh, welcome! I can’t remember if we read this book together or not, but glad to have the benefit of your thoughts again after all these years!

By: Joshua Loveless

Joshua Loveless — Wed, 25 May 2011 01:40:31 +0000

I believe the reason why Winston in the end loves Big Brother is because he hates himself. He hates himself for having betrayed Julia. He hates himself for not being stronger. He hates himself for weakness. His love of life, of self, of Julia is totally taken from him in Room 101. The point of Room 101 is to turn the love of self and others to the Party and turn the hate of the Party to oneself. He loves Big Brother because he is alone, he is half mad, but he is still human. The party has turned the last two remaining human emotions love and hate, emotions that can change the world for better or for worse, and has reversed their flow. Victory for the Party is not over any enemy victory is over the human spirit. Ultimately it is a very hopeless tale that has a great lesson to teach all of us…

By: Mrs. Berrett

Mrs. Berrett — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 18:24:20 +0000

I think the real tool for change is security. When a people are convinced they are no longer secure they’ll give up virtually anything to return to that feeling of safety. I think a lot of it is psychological (using language and symbols to reference the levels of security). Most of the time the actual level of security doesn’t change, just our feelings.
This is definitely something that we see happening right now. I’ll give the masses the benefit of the doubt and assume they give up freedoms with the hope it’s temporary. But as in Orwell’s society, the people just have to be convinced that security can only exist within the government to turn over control.
Thinking of the U.S., there were a lot of personal freedoms taken after 9/11 in the name of protection that never could have been taken had people not been so afraid. It was pretty immediate.

By: Trevor

Trevor — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 20:20:56 +0000

There definitely are some gaps in the logic, hedy, but I wouldn’t let them get in the way. What Orwell describes is a real phenomenon. And even a language that’s been around for thousands and thousands (you can’t be talking about English here, though) of years changes constantly.

On the rebellion front, I’m not sure it is correct to say “they win at last.” That has only happened a few times in history, and, if we go by history, most rebellions fail. Those that win don’t last long, relatively speaking. We live in a unique time, but who’s to say things won’t revert to the more complacent society that won’t accept a government like this for thousands of years? I certainly hope not, and I’m not a doomsdayer who dreads this on a daily basis.

In fact, to me, all of that is beside the point. I really like how Orwell describes a government who uses rhetoric to quash the possibility of a rebellion. Here the government is trying to eliminate words that would allow its subjects to think abstractly enough to rebel. Possible? Perhaps not to the degree in the novel, and perhaps not in the same way. But we see this rhetorical phenomenon happening all the time . . .

By: hedy

hedy — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 15:01:48 +0000

about nineteen eighty four, i think that i can’t figure out the idea that the whole society due to the Party’s power could easily alter its language,a language that has been used for thousands and thousands of years, well, there is something else which is so complicating too, is that how can the party have that powerful position over people while certainly that countries and empires all over the world contain rebellions and finally , historically speaking they win at last… well, that’s what i wanted to say for now. hedy from tunisia.mail:cath_hedy@hotmail.com

By: Trevor

Trevor — Sat, 11 Apr 2009 18:05:55 +0000

Here's an interesting piece by James Wood about Orwell in this weeks The New Yorker. You have to be a subscriber to read the whole thing, but you could always try their free trial where you get four onlines issues.

By: Trevor

Trevor — Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:02:29 +0000

But if I was running the party I would do it this way . . .

If only I had known that before!

By: Max Cairnduff

Max Cairnduff — Thu, 19 Mar 2009 19:39:41 +0000

I can only hope, Mrs. Berrett, that with thoughts like that you never run for high office…

By: Mrs. Berrett

Mrs. Berrett — Thu, 19 Mar 2009 14:05:11 +0000

I have two separate thoughts on this. The first (which comes from my social experimenting side) suggests that Winston may have been conditioned for this. Isn’t it odd his telescreen is in the wrong place? I just have to wonder if that was intentional. Certainly to feel that slight privacy would give anyone a little thrill. So more than just watching him the party was actually guiding him. They’d certainly learn a lot that way and a government like that would have to be savvy on social deviation.
My second thought is that Winston was in a position to need to be watched. He’s quiet, he’s from the past generation, he works in an area where he changes facts. They obviously know he’d at some point realize something was up. Watching Winston may not have been unique, but the fact that he began to be affected made it necessary. But just from a control point of view, you’d have to be more aware of those who could know the truth. However, I wonder if knowing he had the potential to be a threat would have then caused the party to push him to be a threat. Dealing with the black and white is much easier than trying to deal with the gray areas. Streamline it to threat, no threat and governing gets a whole lot easier.
I don’t know that there is any literary backup for these thoughts in the book. But if I was running the party I would do it this way…